Can You Be Saved After You Die?

 

 

 

 

Times Two, Daddy

Can you be saved after you die?

Many years ago…

It was bedtime, and I was snuggling five-year-old Eva. I told a story about a bunny princess named Gertrude who only wore plaid and a squirrel prince named Hank who only wore cotton pajamas.

I paused for the expected interruption and then listened, smiling to tears, as Eva made her revisions. Gertrude became Lizzy in a beautiful pink dress. Hank became Lizzy’s best friend, Molly. She, too, had a beautiful dress—hers was purple. They also had ponies.

As Eva imagined out loud, I thanked my Father for the wonder of my girl. At that moment, I knew Love like I never had before—eternal life in the ever-present now.

We transitioned from story time into our goodnight communion. “Eva, you’re my favorite. I love you best,” I said. It’s a family phrase, a motto. I say this to all my kids, and it’s true every time.

“I love you best, too, Daddy,” she responded, and the game had begun.

“I love you to the tops of the trees and back.” I smiled.

“I love you to the tops of the trees, the moon, the stars, to Jupiter, and back.” She knew how to play the game.

I went big. “I love you to the top of the trees, the moon, the stars, Jupiter, the universe, and to infinity and beyond.”

We continued for a few more minutes; each taking turns surpassing the last statement—a million, billion, gazillion to infinity and beyond. I had just exhausted my imagination with a litany of love when she looked at me mischievously. I could see the wheels spinning in her little mind.

Then she stated, all clever like, “Times two, Daddy.”

“Times two, Daddy” flips everything on its head. A five-year-old applies the smallest multiplier she comprehends, and it blows up the foundations of all measurement-based thinking, including all the measuring that goes on within the Christian faith.

We have all played this game in some form or another. We love this game, because it reveals something profoundly beautiful and true.

You see, this is a game of measurements played with a measureless revelation; a game where we apply finite equations to a Love that transcends dimensions of time and space.

Measureless & Timeless

Can you be saved after you die?
Is my perspective on the nature of love finite?

In Ephesians 3, Paul wrote, “And I pray that you, being rooted and established in love, may have power, together with all the Lord’s holy people, to grasp how wide and long and high and deep is the love of Christ, and to know this love that surpasses knowledge—that you may be filled to the measure of all the fullness of God.” (Ephesians 3:16-19)

Using the language of earth, Paul played the game I played with my five-year-old, describing God’s love as wider than forever, longer than eternity, higher than a million, billion, gazillion, and deeper than infinity and beyond. Then, he encouraged us to try and take Love’s measure—to be “filled” to “the fullness.”

After Paul exhausted his imagination with a litany of love, he smiled cleverly—at least, that’s how I imagine it. Then, with all the guilelessness wonder of a five-year-old, he said, “Times two, Daddy.”

Or, “Now to him who is able to do immeasurably more than all we ask or imagine, according to his power that is at work within us, to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, forever and ever! Amen.” Eph 3:20-21

The nature of God is love (See 1 John 4: 7-8).

Love is an infinite revelation (See Eph 3:16-21).

Love was before time existed (See John 17:5 & 24)

“Before time existed”?  That statement stretches the imagination of most linear time travelers like us. What does it even mean?

I think it means that the nature of love is beyond our capacity to comprehend. The moment we think we have its measure, a five-year-old blows up our understanding with “Times two, Daddy.”

Love Is,

Jesus on a cross,

one with Father and Holy Spirit,

self-giving,

other-centered,

reconciling,

transcending time and space,

beyond our capability to count or measure;

beyond our ability to comprehend,

and beyond our capacity to describe.

But wonderfully, we try, and along the way, we awaken to discover and rediscover Love’s measureless ways.

And we know this Love is true. We know beyond understanding that the measureless nature of Love is truer than anything else that’s ever been true; truer than life or death, powers or principalities, fears or worries, the present or future. Even the powers of hell cannot separate us from this Measureless Love. (See Rom 8:38)

Penal Substitutionary Atonement

Can you be saved after you die?
Is God’s reconciling love limited to the constraints of time?

God is love. He was before and will be after. His love is an ever-expanding revelation. Every measurement we attempt to apply to Love’s nature can be undone and exposed as infinitesimal with a five-year-old’s multiplier of two.

As Christians and, more significantly, as humans, we’re aware of the indwelling measureless nature of love, know it to be wonderfully true beyond our capacity to understand, and know it’s our salvation from sin and every lie of separation that sin propagates. But like Adam and Eve, who were deceived by the self-righteous delusion of control, we often demand that God’s love fit into the box of our finite understanding.

This is where a proper academic theologian would write in-depth about atonement theories—specifically, the theory of Penal Substitutionary Atonement, as that theory has ravaged Western Christian thinking for a long time. But I’m not writing as a proper academic theologian. I’m writing as the dad of that five-year-old.

So, I’ll be brief. Penal Substitutionary Atonement is the belief “that God is not willing or able to simply forgive sin without first requiring a payment for it.” Jesus, God’s beloved child, became that cruel and bloody payment.

As I’ve already noted, many of us have probably heard it presented this way: “God can’t look upon sin,” or “The Father looked away.” In other words, “Papa turned away from His boy.”

This theory propagates the idea that God’s reconciling love is only available because Jesus has been punished as a payment for our sins. It’s an atonement theory constructed to support a retributive lens on God. This atonement theory is built on the delusion that sin is powerful enough to separate us from God’s love, and it makes a religion out of measuring the distances between us.

It suggests that Measureless Love took measure and determined humanity to be outside the parameters of His measureless love—as if Love could stop being wider than forever, longer than eternity, higher than a million, billion, gazillion, and deeper than infinity and beyond; as if an infinite Love must submit to our finite equations regarding salvation and reconciliation; as if God counts our sins against us.

My five-year-old exposed this foolishness with a multiplier of two. And 2 Corinthians 5:19 tells us that at the cross, “God was reconciling the world to Himself in Christ, not counting anyone’s sins against them.”  

The notion that God counts sin is an arrogant finite approach to His love, because it preaches separation and retribution with vague promises of some future reward that cannot be experienced today. It’s the “What am I still lacking?” superhighway that promises eternal life but never delivers. This notion so belittles the nature of Greater Love as to be laughed at. Yet sadly, so many Christians have had to navigate their faith through this measurement-based certainty.

We cling to experiences with Measureless Love as a sailor clings to the wreckage of a ship lost at sea. We know, in our hearts, that only a love that is measurelessly good, measurelessly reconciling, freely given and received, can save us. But, despite this Good News, many sincere people keep drowning in the ocean of the church’s religious infatuation with making people pay. And punishment is the payment.

Many Christians believe most people must pay by being condemned to some form of conscious, eternal torment.

Meanwhile, the clock is ticking.

The Clock Is Ticking…

Can you be saved after you die? Is God’s wrath eternal but His reconciling love, mercy, and forgiveness limited to the constraints of time?

The ticking clock is one of the most used tropes in Hollywood. There’s a bomb and a clock attached to it, and it’s counting down. There’s a red wire and a blue wire. And if the hero cuts the wrong wire, it’s smithereens for him, or her. And if it’s a good movie, the stakes are even higher, and it’s smithereens for the whole world.

It’s called “the race against time.” 

Without time, we have nothing with which to measure the severity of the potential destruction. If the clock isn’t ticking, the bomb can’t go off, and, well, there’s no money to be made off that movie—or that religion.

For those who practice retributive thinking, God is not ultimately LOVE; God is ultimately TIME, and when time runs out, God’s measureless reconciling love must submit to it.

In measurement-based systems, God’s forgiveness, grace, kindness, and reconciling love are ultimately limited aspects of His nature, while we redefine wrath and condemnation as God’s eternal and defining punishing attribute.

Every measurement-based system essentially preaches that Adam’s actions leading to the fall have had eternal ramifications, whereas Jesus’ reconciling work at the cross is limited and constrained to the finite ticking of a clock. It’s as though God’s forgiveness, mercy, grace, healing, freedom, redemption, reconciliation, and restoration must submit to some finite measure of time.

Measurement-based systems focus on the measure of sin instead of the measureless nature of reconciling love.

And Jesus dismantled that ticking time bomb.

He stepped inside the delusion of separation and retribution. He set us free to play the game I played with my five-year-old—a game in which “Times two, Daddy” unveils an ever-expanding, never-ending, beyond all we can ask or imagine, measureless revelation of the perfection that is the nature of God and His heart toward us.

I believe the idea that Christ died as a payment made to span the distance between us is a fallen, finite way of thinking—a transactional delusion. Jesus stepped inside that lie at the cross and blew it up from the inside—get it?

Even better, the bomb has been dismantled. “It is finished,” Jesus declared. Reconciling Love transcends dimensions of time and space!

So, “Can you be saved after you die?”

I don’t know.

Yes, I sure hope so.

And I know beyond understanding “…that nothing can ever separate us from God’s love; neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons, neither our fears for today nor our worries about tomorrow. Even the powers of hell cannot separate us from God’s love. 

No power in the sky above or in the earth below—indeed, nothing in all creation—will ever be able to separate us from the love of God that is revealed in Christ Jesus our Lord…” (Rom 8:38-39)

Excerpted from my book, Leaving and Finding Jesus

Jason Clark is a bestselling storyteller who writes to reveal the transforming kindness of the love of God in a world traumatized by the religious abuses done in the name of the love of God. He and his wife, Karen, live in North Carolina with their three children, Madeleine, Ethan, and Eva.

8 Comments

  1. Kathryn

    So, So good, I’m on a journey of deconstructing ingrained religious mind sets and rediscovering the Real Jesus and His Father. So precious, deep down we know it to be true but are afraid of the backlash of the NT pharaseeism prevalent in our western culture… thank you Jason and bless your family and your journey ‘ into’ our Beautiful God!

    Reply
    • Jason Clark

      Thanks, Kathryn!

      I think this is a conversation so many are having and as each day passes there’s more freedom to rediscover! Praying grace and wonder over your journey of discovery and re-discovery of our Beautiful God!

      Reply
  2. Robert

    So beautifully written, drawing the heart into the wonder of the width, height, length and depth of Papa’s love. Then, “I don’t know “.

    What!!!? You don’t know if you can be saved after you die. That was a little bit of a let down I must say. As I’m reading my heart is pounding in my chest yes, yes YES!!

    I would never be dogmatic about, reject or shame anyone for not coming to the same conclusion as I. But this love that you speak of has lead me to become a very convinced believer in the total restoration of creation and that would include all of Papa’s prodigal children. That such a father love would never be content to lose any. That love would never be content until it could love all and be loved back.

    Then the argument of free will, we have freedom to reject. I am convinced that we do not truly have a free will, because a truly freed will, a will that has been healed of whatever is wrong with it cannot and will not reject its Heavenly Father’s in the end. Love will not fail.

    Love wins!!!

    Sorry, I’ll step down off my box now.

    Love your writings and I’m looking forward to reading your book.

    Grace and peace

    Reply
    • Jason Clark

      Love the quote!! And everything you wrote!!

      Though I’m not sure how it all works, I’m settled in my heart that reconciling love wins!!

      As to the article, I wanted to build the narrative and let the reader wrestle down their own convictions.

      That said,

      “I don’t know” was followed by

      “But I know beyond understanding…”

      Which was the whole point, but maybe too subtle haha.

      Love ya, man, thanks for the beautiful thoughts!

      Reply
  3. John O'Brien

    I can think of only one word to describe this email: Masterpiece!
    Thank you, and bless you.

    Reply
    • Jason Clark

      Thanks, John!

      Bless you, man.

      Reply
  4. Richard W. Rogers

    God is God,
    Who is man that he should decide what aGod will and will not do.
    As a man, all I know is Christ;
    His birth…
    His life…
    His redemption…
    His love!
    So I will not seek or try to answer questions that profit little or nothing. But ask me about my Jesus.
    Love you Jason.
    Rick

    Reply
    • Jason Clark

      LOVE THIS!

      Thanks, Rick

      Reply

Submit a Comment

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

YOU ALSO MIGHT LIKE…

When I Stopped Reading the Whole Bible

Jesus is my lens, my true narrative. His perfect love is my conviction. His goodness is my faith. Every question I have, every relationship or circumstance, every scripture, including the tension Job represents, is measured against the measureless revelation of Jesus.

PETER HIETT / WHAT ABOUT HELL?

The goodness of God but hell, atonement but hell, reformation but hell, scripture but hell, Calvinism but hell; in this podcast Peter Hiett describes hell as “Satan’s big but.” In this conversation Peter walks us through the story of our own creation, the goodness of God’s reconciling love, the relational kindness of a God who encounters, sets free and transforms.

Peter describes a God who delights in His creation, a God who destroys what is evil, creates what is good, and invites us to observe our own creation in Christ Jesus.

DANIEL GROTHE / THE POWER OF PLACE

Daniel Grothe and the guys discuss his new book, The Power of Place, which speaks the sense of loneliness that many feel in today’s age of hypermobility and noncommittal wandering, reminding us of the ancient vow of stability and teaching us how we can lead a richer life of friendship, community, and purpose.

They also touch on the deconstruction movement within the church, how authoritarian leadership has wounded and undermined trust, and how healing and connection are available only where we practice the long game of family.

This Will Be Our Finest Hour

Though it has felt just the opposite during this quarantine time, this has been one of the greatest times of personal growth and Kingdom advancement for the body of Christ.

MIKE POPOVICH / PRAYER & QUANTUM PHYSICS

Mike is a brilliant communicator and pastors Freedom Ministries. In this podcast we talk about prayer and oneness with God and Mike teaches us quantum physics! Mike reveals how scripture and quantum physics are not in conflict with each other

A Wonderful Life!

Every life on this planet is in part a revelation of the creativity, diversity, and symmetry in the heart of God and an ever-expanding canvas paraphrase of the gospel!

Can I see and love what Papa sees and loves in every other person today?

The Incarnation, Christ in us!

Pin It on Pinterest

Share This

Share This

Share this post with your friends!