LEAVING (& FINDING) JESUS WITH DEREK TURNER & JASON CLARK
God’s sovereignty revealed by Jesus through cruciform, self-giving love, the nature of trust, intimacy, and union, and the transforming truth that there is no shadow of turning with God, in this podcast the guys explore Jason’s upcoming book, Leaving (& Finding) Jesus.
This conversation juxtaposes an inclusive, reconciling, self-giving, unconditional view of God’s love against an excluding, hierarchal, punishment-focused, conditional view of God’s love.
You can find the book on our books page.
QUOTES
“God became one of us, to rescue all of us.” Derek
“The sovereignty of God is self-giving; it is sacrificial in nature.” Jason
“Jesus is the Rabi that walks us through the scriptures; His perspective is the one that we need.” Derek
“I am so convinced Jesus never leaves, that nothing separates us from the love of God.” Jason
“If God is a punishing God, and we become what we behold, then you can justify pretty much anything in the name of Him, and we’ve all felt this abuse.” Jason
“There is no greater love than self-giving love that reconciles all things.” Jason
“I feel like your book is going to help people experience peace; that it’s ok to ask questions, to have doubt, to leave a Jesus that you’ve grown up with that might be contrary to who Jesus really is.” Derek
For more on Leaving (& Finding) Jesus click HERE
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NAEEM FAZAL / REIMAGINING GOD
Naeem Fazal, founding pastor of Mosaic Church, and author of Ex-Muslim, talks about deconstruction or reimaging God. Naeem talks about the importance of being able to recognize God outside of our personal context, how to view sin, how to approach scripture, and a beautiful gospel that’s not just about the Jesus who saves but about the Jesus who is restoring humanity and all creation.
QUOTES
“My whole life has been about reimagining God because I started off as a Muslim.”
“Our mission as Mosaic, (our church) is to reclaim the message of Jesus.”
“Not recognizing God out of context is the biggest sin of religious people.”
“We sometimes preach Jesus and preach the gospel to solve a particular kind of sin a particular type of problem.”
“We have sinner and saint, but God sees oppressed and free.”
“What Jesus was doing on the cross was not just saving us so we wouldn’t go to hell. It’s way bigger than that; it’s liberating us to live in this eternal Kingdom that can be accessed here and on the other side. He was restoring not just humanity, but all creation.”
Regarding scripture / “It’s an inspired tool that God has used to encourage my faith; it is not what I anchor my soul on.”
“Here’s what happens when you anchor your soul on the text. The text becomes sorcery. You say it a certain way to get what you want. So, these stories and conversations become like incantations that are used in Jesus’ name. People don’t get that, but that’s Harry Potter.”
For more on Naeem Fazal
www.naeemfazal.org
Mosaic Church
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DALE HOWIE / UNSPOKEN SERMONS ON THE GOOD NEWS OF INCLUSION
Paraphrasing the sermons of George MacDonald, Dale Howie shares his sometimes painful, often beautiful, journey of awakening to the irreducible truth of life discovered in relationship. He speaks to grace, our common Fatherhood, our inclusion in Christ’s life, death and resurrection, our union, and the wonder of our humanity. A humble storyteller and relational theologian, Dale speaks as a father on behalf of Our Father, who loves all His children with a reconciling love.
QUOTES
“The God that’s alone in heaven doesn’t love anybody. He creates out of need. The Trinity, they don’t need anything. They have life and fellowship in abundance…they wanted to share their relationship with us”
“MacDonald hammers home that the cause of all of our problems is the fact that we will not accept our common Fatherhood.”
“Love fulfills the law to overflowing…” George MacDonald
“One question is worth a thousand answers. Paul young
“The questions come out of brokenness, come out of failure, they come out of all the lies you’ve been told and all the things you’ve believed and all the things you have told.”
“I can’t sit across from somebody who isn’t His child.”
“Anointing is nothing but my spirit speaking directly to yours and it can only happen because I own it.”
“…This life is simply goodness, as good as the very life of God is good and filled with the very joy of our being.” George MacDonald
For more on Dale Howie
www.frontporchtheology.org
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SHEILA GREGOIRE / THE GREAT SEX RESCUE
Intimacy within marriage, the connection between intimacy and mutuality, the nature of trust, the definition of sex, addressing transactional vs relational thinking, dismantling obligation, addressing objectification and broken ideologies developed from Eph 5:22, “Wives submit to your husbands…” Sheila Gregoire practically rethinks sex so husbands and wives can experience intimacy, joy, and deeper connection.
QUOTES
“The conversation around intimacy in marriage has largely ignored mutuality.”
“In order to have intimacy you have to have two people who both matter.”
“What, too often, the evangelical church has done is elevated one person’s needs, specifically the husbands over the wife, and that has really wrecked sex for everybody.”
“A lot of the reason that women have trouble reaching orgasm, that women have bad views of sex, that women just have trouble with sex in general, is not necessarily because of their husbands, but because of what they have been taught in church and in Christian circles and in Christian resources.”
“A lot of women feel very objectified, especially in the church….If you talk to evangelical women, almost all of them have stories of what they were told when they were hitting puberty about how they were now a stumbling block to men. Even elders and pastors…commenting on what they were wearing. And it’s really traumatizing.”
“We’re basically telling boys that sexual attraction and lust are the same thing…we’re raising a whole generation of boys to feel guilty for normal biological reactions…Jesus did not say, “whoever sees a beautiful woman has committed lust He said, ‘whoever looks with lust has committed adultery. So, it’s a deliberate action, it’s a deliberate mindset…”
“The church has made marriage into an idol, and our whole approach to marriage has been wrong because our approach is, ‘let’s keep marriages together.’ And, ‘it’s a success if people don’t get divorced.’ No, it’s a success when people look like Jesus. It’s a success when we walk in His steps…when we achieve healing and wholeness.”
“God loves you more than He loves the institution of marriage.”
For more on Sheila Gregoire
www.tolovehonorandvacuum.com
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BRIAN MCLAREN / FAITH AFTER DOUBT
“Christian faith, for me, is no longer a static location but a great spiritual journey…what matters most…is not where we are but where we’re going.” This podcast is a gentle invitation to discover a way of faith defined by love. Brian and Jason discuss navigating rejection, stepping away from literalism, and inerrancy in our approach to scripture and faith, and their personal journey of trusting that God is better than our best thoughts about Him.
QUOTES
“My theology was in turmoil…it’s falling apart and I can’t save it.”
“You have never had a thought of me (God) that is too good, that is better than I really am.”
“All certainty is relative, in fact, there is no correlation between certainty and truth.”
“Playfulness is really important in our spiritual life.”
“It’s better to be rejected for who you actually are than accepted for a false image of yourself.”
For more on Brian McLaren
www.brianmclaren.net
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AWAKENING! with DEREK TURNER & JASON CLARK
An infinite love, the nature of revelation, a kindness that changes our minds, the joy of our salvation discovered as we awaken to the resurrection, the risen Christ within us, in this podcast Derek and Jason discuss how all creation is awakening to the transforming certainty of sacrificial love and resurrection life.
QUOTES
“Love is more engaged with connection than it is with correction.” Derek
“Awaken is to bring something to someone’s attention for the very first time.” Derek
“Joy is the serious business of heaven.” C.S. Lewis
“My mind is constrained to a timeline, but love is a measureless revelation.” Jason
“My certainty is not in ‘right or wrong’ my certainty is Love.” Jason
“Could it be that entombed in every heart is a reality that the heart hasn’t caught up to yet?” Derek
“The only thing that changes someone’s mind is kindness.” Jason
“Awakened hearts see Jesus everywhere.” Derek
“We’re un-tombing Jesus within people.” Derek
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KRISTIN DU MEZ / JESUS AND JOHN WAYNE
Patriarchy, authoritarian rule, the nature of power and privilege in America and the Church, the deconstruction movement, Christians in politics; in this podcast, Professor and Historian Kristin Du Mez, examines the impact of perhaps the most influential subculture in this country, white evangelicalism. This conversation explores how evangelicals have stepped away from the Jesus of the Gospels, from sacrificial love. “But what was once done, can be undone.”
QUOTES
Jesus divested Himself of power. And yet, when we look at American Evangelicalism over the last half-century and more there is a very different understanding of power at t’s heart. It is, ‘the more power the better.’ The more worldly power…political power…military power so that we can protect our truth, God’s truth, our truth, it’s the same. But it’s not that God’s truth defines ours…”
“Christians ought to be trouble makers within their parties. We should be the voices of conscience all the time, the ones who are not dependable party liners…Christians should be uniting across party differences…”
“Many (Christians) are deconstructing these cultural layers that for so long have been sold to them as orthodox Christianity, take-it-or-leave-it kinda things, and it never fit right with them.”
For more on Professor Kristin Du Mez
www.thepassiontranslation.com
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BRIAN SIMMONS / THE PASSION TRANSLATION
The Passion Translation & the Fiery Love of God
“The bible, minus love, equals false teaching, false living, and fosters an anger in the soul of man.” Brian Simmons, author of The Passion Translation, talks about approaching scripture with a love theology, the oppressive impact of hyper literalism, women in ministry, equality, union, Jesus’ humanity inside the Trinity, the finished work of the cross, and the passionate, powerful, transforming love of God.
QUOTES
“Pauline theology will get perverted if you don’t start at the song of songs. I’m convinced that Paul got most of his doctrinal teachings from encounters with the Lord and from an open bible with Song of Songs.”
“It’s just error to hyper literalize the song of songs, it’s a beautiful symphony of love… it’s a book that literally starts with a kiss”
“We have forgotten that Jesus Christ is a human being, that inside the Trinity is a man…and this human nature of Jesus is mingled with the divine…”
“A human being can be moved with feelings and passions… Jesus is every bit a man, inside the trinity. The universe is ruled by the passions of a man.”
“How we hear is every bit as important as what we are reading.”
“This love theology is the key to the great harvest of the nations.”
“God has to love you to be God. It’s almost like He wouldn’t be God if He didn’t love you intensely, powerfully.”
“To dishonor women and to say they can’t minister…goes counter to the heart of God.”
“You said earlier you’re a relational theologian, that’s exactly how we need to interpret scripture.”
“You literally have to have a love lens on your heart to read scripture, then you’ll read it the way God has written it for us.”
“The bible, minus love, equals false teaching, false living, and fosters an anger in the soul of man.”
“He that is joined to the Lord is one spirit (1 Cor 6:17), so the union is complete. When He said it’s finished it’s not only the work of the cross but it’s the perfected union that He has given us.”
“Nothing can separate us, not things present or things future, He doesn’t even mention the past because we don’t have a past. Our past ended with three nails; we only have a destiny, not a history.”
For more on Brian Simmons & The Passion Translation
www.thepassiontranslation.com
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DAVID TENSEN / YOU ARE NOT ALONE
Trauma, pain, empathy like Jesus, and healing for the oppressed, misunderstood, lost, or broken; in this podcast David Tensen shares how we are loved and not alone. Addressing how shame and condemnation are compounded by religion, the guys talked specifically about abortion and the LGBTQ community with an invitation to love like Jesus, through our union with God and reconciliation.
QUOTES
“Christ, to know Him and the fellowship of His sufferings, I never realized there was fellowship in His suffering.”
“Jesus, descended into hell, there’s nowhere that He is not…including after you breathe your last breath, death has been overcome.”
“God’s mercy endures forever… I don’t know if forever has a full stop…”
Regarding abortion… “Why don’t you foster some kids, look after some single moms and then have your say, because it’s cheap to hold your stone…the research shows if you support single mothers the abortion goes down…”
“People are not problems to solve their people to love”
For more on David Tensen
www.davidtensen.com
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BRUXY CAVEY / LOVING GOD BY LOVING OUR NEIGHBOR
Bruxy Cavey, author, and pastor of The Meeting House, dives into relational faith, loving God through loving our neighbor, repenting with a hopeful future focus, how doubt is connected to our faith, how we are not people of the book (bible) we are people of the person (Jesus), and three perspectives on hell concluding with the fact that the New Testament church never leveraged hell to get people to make a decision for Jesus.
QUOTES
“Jesus was no theologian He was just God who told stories.” Madeleine L’Engle
“There are people who will hurt other people to show how much they love God…they will boast in their love of God by doing damage to people around them…”
“A new command I give you, just love others as I love you.”
“No longer is it love God and love your neighbor, now it’s love God by loving your neighbor. That is our faith.”
“Meditation, prayer, bible study, going to church all play back up to the band…the soloist in the band of Christian faith is loving others really, really well. Even our enemies…we love our neighbors we love or enemies, there’s no one left not to love in the spirituality of Jesus.”
“More often than not He uses the word repent to change the way we think about the coming Kingdom. ‘The Kingdom is at hand, repent and hear the good news.’ He attaches it (repent) to what’s coming, not what happened before; to what we should be hopeful about not, what we should be ashamed about.”
“They worshiped him but some doubted…It’s this group of doubting worshipers that Jesus trusts the future of the church to.”
“We read the book, study the book, we love the book, we memorize the book, we meditate on the book, so that we can get to know the Person, not just so we can get to know the book. Unless we make that final maneuver to see Jesus as the Word of God, we’re doing it wrong.”
“Jesus is the authoritative inerrant, infallible Word of God and scripture is the inspired gift of the Spirit to lead us to Jesus.”
“Hell is never used by the New Testament church in their evangelistic presentations to try and get people to accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior.”
“Threats don’t help a love relationship… So even if hell does work (to get people to make a decision for Jesus) it works for the wrong reasons.”
For more on Bruxy Cavey
www.bruxy.com
The Meeting House
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